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Author Topic: Where's the asbestos?  (Read 2268 times)
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radojko
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« on: August 04, 2017, 10:14:38 AM »

Hello everyone,

So, Australia just announced that they will strictly enforce laws that ban the import of vehicles that contain ANY asbestos containing components. Exceptions will be granted if documents are provided certifying that suspect components are asbestos-free.

Any care to offer a list of things to examine and replace?

Thanks,
Bob

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2112
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« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2017, 10:17:56 AM »

Further reading;

https://www.hemmings.com/blog/2017/08/04/crackdown-on-asbestos-essentially-halts-collector-car-exports-to-australia/?refer=news

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Dan Case
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« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2017, 11:06:53 AM »

The article didn't mention, I didn't see it anyway, so think about
- some seam sealers
- some adhesives
- some thread sealing compounds
- valve stem packing (thinking of a Cobra shut off valve for the heater here as a probable)
- some undercoatings for rust prevention
- some sound dampening materials, mat and spray on type
- some heat shield materials
- some label stock
- some fasteners or other metal parts or assemblies finished in phosphate and oil and “talc” (especially ones dyed black or have better salt spray resistance)
- some electrical components
- any plastic injection molded part filled with "talc" (wherever talc in mined so comes some asbestos)
- some molded or extruded rubber products coated in "talc" to prevent sticking in storage and shipping
- inner tubes for tires "lubricated" on the outside with with talc as in the 1960s

The Fortune 500 manufacturing company that I worked in "eliminated" asbestos in all productions in 1983. The process started by telling suppliers that asbestos had to be eliminated back around 1979. It was a major expense to find acceptable technologies that didn't require the benefits cheap asbestos provided. Sounds simple but company defined (the buyer is always right) what test methods had to be used and what the criteria was "proof".  Not every supplier had access to the same test procedure or apparatus so they did or had what testing done they could. The suppliers had to send production samples of parts or materials for our testing organization to verify. No surprise, not everything tested by suppliers got past our testing. That created more rounds of re-engineer and retest.  It took every bit of those years of advance notice to work through it all.

So, so my thoughts on worst case scenario is Restorer X has just gone over a car and certifies it “asbestos free”. The car hits the docks of some country banning the import of any asbestos for any reason and their testing comes up with unacceptable levels of asbestos in even a single piece they check and you might not enjoy the rest of the process.

When I first read the article I thought that importing an original Cobra in original specifications would just not happen. Even things like small electrical motors have pieces inside that probably contain asbestos.


« Last Edit: August 04, 2017, 11:57:41 AM by rr64 » Logged

Dan Case (a.k.a. rr64)
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« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2017, 11:20:03 AM »

Ahh, the Government hard at work to protect everyone and the environment.  Do you realize how many people could die from the brake pads off a 1966 Shelby?  I swear I can't sleep at night thinking about it.

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Brian Glover
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« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2017, 11:31:52 AM »

Brake pads?

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Dan Case
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« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2017, 11:38:23 AM »

Brake pads?

Major ones
- brake pads
- brake shoes
- clutch discs
- some engine gaskets
- some exhaust gaskets
- some transmission gaskets
 
but the current trend in more than one country (or even within one country private party selling a car to a second private party) is ANY part or material that THEIR test method can detect asbestos in.  I have read stories of cars being CRUDELY (carelessly) partially dismantled and samples collected (take the whole part, cut a piece of a part off, scrap samples off) from a wide variety of places and parts. Damaged done to the car in the name of sampling is not the government's problem.

« Last Edit: August 04, 2017, 11:59:19 AM by rr64 » Logged

Dan Case (a.k.a. rr64)
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« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2017, 11:40:58 AM »

Brake pads?

The article link by "2112" lists a number of items including brake pads and shoes.



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« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2017, 12:35:18 PM »

Ahh, the Government hard at work to protect everyone and the environment.  Do you realize how many people could die from the brake pads off a 1966 Shelby?  I swear I can't sleep at night thinking about it.

Have you watched the Pit Crew change Tires at a NASCAR Race?  That is a LOT of Brake Dust on the Wheels after just 30 Laps not to mention what didn't stick to the Wheels as it was going around the Track.

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gt350hr
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« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2017, 01:21:19 PM »

  Concours judging in Australia will have to be amended for original intake, fuel pump, and header gaskets on Cobras and Shelbys. idea

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owner 6S477 HERTZ White w/Blue stripes-1of18-since 1974. OVER 3,500 drag strip runs made in it since then. My candidate for the "worlds Most drag raced Shelby" More added all the time.
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« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2017, 03:46:43 PM »

They are just catching up to replacing asbestos linoleum on showroom floors.  I wonder what is on the floors of the old government buildings...

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« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2017, 04:04:11 PM »

Have you watched the Pit Crew change Tires at a NASCAR Race?  That is a LOT of Brake Dust on the Wheels after just 30 Laps not to mention what didn't stick to the Wheels as it was going around the Track.
No more asbestos in brake shoes - except for large trucks. Popcorn ceilings, floor tiles, dry wall, older cement siding, insulation, etc. They took the asbestos out of the orings on the Shuttle and after the Challenger blew up they put it back in. California in all its wisdom declared asbestos it's state rock - all the farmland in the central valley is full of the stuff.

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preaction
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« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2017, 05:58:24 PM »

Mustangs in the 60's came with molded asbestos brake linings. An asbestos fiber can float in the air up to 72 hours and your "dose" is cumulative as asbestos doesn't break down in the body.

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shelby001
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« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2017, 06:34:37 PM »

Mustangs in the 60's came with molded asbestos brake linings. An asbestos fiber can float in the air up to 72 hours and your "dose" is cumulative as asbestos doesn't break down in the body.
Oh for you guys & gals born in the 60`s your mother used baby powder on you  which had asbestos in it . Smiley

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GT350Lad
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« Reply #13 on: August 04, 2017, 06:44:19 PM »

Major ones
- brake pads
- brake shoes
- clutch discs
- some engine gaskets
- some exhaust gaskets
- some transmission gaskets
 
but the current trend in more than one country (or even within one country private party selling a car to a second private party) is ANY part or material that THEIR test method can detect asbestos in.  I have read stories of cars being CRUDELY (carelessly) partially dismantled and samples collected (take the whole part, cut a piece of a part off, scrap samples off) from a wide variety of places and parts. Damaged done to the car in the name of sampling is not the government's problem.

That's not good, it was only a few months ago I pulled off my original tri y's and H pipe gaskets! Luckily I kept them safe in the top of the toolbox!  Head knock

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6S273
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« Reply #14 on: August 05, 2017, 05:22:29 AM »

Asbestos in cars has always been a greater threat to the mechanics. The largest problem by far were the brake pads. Second would be the clutch discs.

Substitutes have been found for them but when you do pads on a car you need to GENTLY hose the brakes down so not as to air bound the dust. You also need to put a catch pan under the assembly to catch the water.

Car mechanics here that work for dealerships are required to have a medical exam with lung x-rays annually.

With the "cheap" brake rotors available now, around $30 each, many shops have gotten rid of the brake lathes, don't cut rotors and drums. When you cut them, you are just releasing some undesirables into your immediate atmosphere.

If you do a lot of brakes, the exposure is very high. For the average person that does a set of brakes once a year, it is almost not measurable.


I think what that Australian law is aiming at though is a question of what is going to happen to a car that is being dismantled eventually or where the old brake pads are going to go to? That is going to be a government problem at some point in the future for them and why not nip it in the bud before it happens?

Legislators are envisioning millions of cars contributing to a potential problem with an unknown outcome. Not literally a few classic cars that get driven hardly any miles at all?


My maternal grandfather died from Mesothelioma. He worked in the Brooklyn Navy yard spraying asbestos on the hulls of the ships.
It isn't that no one knew that asbestos wasn't a problem, it was just that no one was required to use a protective mask or employers required to supply them.
When you are making $10 a day for labor, you put a handkerchief over your nose and mouth. You couldn't afford the mask and sure as H ell, the company wasn't going to pay for it?

Until the mid-70's in NYC, the air quality tests showed a high content of air bound asbestos. That was from the sprayed on fire proofing on the structural steel of the buildings under construction and from the brake dust from the traffic.

Not to mention that, you could also literally walk along any street and scoop up the lead from the exhaust along the curbside.


The problem with the EPA is not that they are making "you" do what you don't want to, it's that there are too many still left alive now to (word is not allowed) about it, that should have been dead years ago?   Wink

« Last Edit: August 05, 2017, 05:34:24 AM by stickshift » Logged
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