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Author Topic: Magnum 500 Identification  (Read 37010 times)
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6S1640
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« Reply #105 on: October 17, 2017, 09:25:44 AM »

I have seen hertz wheels that someone has made out of Chrysler wheels and you wouldn't use them on your car maybe someone else's car. The weld area of the Chrysler wheel is visible when moved back farther for the true Hertz wheel positioning. There is always a distortion in the chrome from that Chrysler weld area near the center regardless of what you do to try and smooth it out before chroming.  I understand what you are saying about the backspacing but that is only if you are dealing with the same exact correct rim (hoop?). The rim style is rare even if on a incorrect Chrysler wheel. It has been my experience that more times then not it is a completely different rim style that someone thinks is the valuable Hertz wheel. They are hoping they have the diamond in the cracker jack box. Sometimes the markings are obscured by grease ,mud ,rust etc.  That is why I insist on seeing the front side of the rim so that I can confirm that it is the correct rim regardless of markings. I have had enough practice and seen enough Hertz wheels that I can tell the correct backspacing by looking at the front of the rim visually. That is unless I am looking at a picture where most or all of the rim detail is obscured be glare. Just the way I fell comfortable doing it.I know others are different.

Hi Bob,  I think we are agreeing, just saying in different ways.  I do agree with what you said.

Take care

Cory

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Bob Gaines
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« Reply #106 on: October 17, 2017, 09:50:46 AM »

Hi Bob,  I think we are agreeing, just saying in different ways.  I do agree with what you said.

Take care

Cory
Chug a Lug

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« Reply #107 on: October 17, 2017, 12:34:13 PM »

   What has always been a curiosity to me is why was the center installed in the wheel in the "reversed" style. By reversed , I mean the "normal orientation" of the outer rim or hoop has the "drop center" ( for tire mounting purposes) toward the outside of the wheel. This is so the wheel is held face up when mounting tires. The Shelby Magnum is made so the drop center is on the inside and the outside of the wheel has to be "down" to mount the tire. It was popular in the late 50's , early 60's to buy "chrome reverse" wheels for your car. the center was removed , "reversed" and welded back in to produce a deeper looking wheel. There is enough space on the drop center of the hoop used for the Shelby Magnum to get the offset in either direction. So was the wheel reversed simply for the look? Maybe that is a question for Chuck C.

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« Reply #108 on: October 17, 2017, 01:26:09 PM »

Guys- I sent this seller a ? request when these first came up.  I was asking for a visual of the backspacing measurement.  I did so because I bought two wheels from a eBay seller with good feedback who said the backspacing was under 3.5, upon arrival the wheels had over 4.0 backspacing - I had to go thru a dispute process but received my money back.  I only note because wheels came from same state as this new seller that happens to be new to eBay.  I am not saying these are not Shelby wheels but the lack of an answer to my question and my previous experience should make others cautious. 

Again, no idea on these wheels but I would ask for best visuals possible before spending a dime.

Cheers

Cory C

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Bob Gaines
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« Reply #109 on: October 17, 2017, 02:05:33 PM »

Guys- I sent this seller a ? request when these first came up.  I was asking for a visual of the backspacing measurement.  I did so because I bought two wheels from a eBay seller with good feedback who said the backspacing was under 3.5, upon arrival the wheels had over 4.0 backspacing - I had to go thru a dispute process but received my money back.  I only note because wheels came from same state as this new seller that happens to be new to eBay.  I am not saying these are not Shelby wheels but the lack of an answer to my question and my previous experience should make others cautious. 

Again, no idea on these wheels but I would ask for best visuals possible before spending a dime.

Cheers

Cory C
Cory, for future reference the correct backspacing measurements is all good and fine and my make you fill confident but is a false sense of security. That alone will not mean that the wheels are genuine unless the rim is the correct reverse style /profile on the front side as I mentioned in my previous post . The back spacing will help but doesn't answer all of the important questions unless coupled with other details. The appearance of the front side of the rim and the relationship between where the center is welded in the rim on the other hand answers all of the important questions in one view. You should be able to tell immediately visually if it first is the correct rim style and second if has the correct backspacing. I wish there was a easy way to teach the difference of the front correct rim profile to others . Visually I suppose having two wheels side by side and studying the difference between the Chrysler wheel and Hertz wheel is the best way. Once you see the difference between those two and compare them to a generic magnum it becomes easy. That is the way I learned.  A clear picture of the front rim profile as it relates to the center is the first order of business IMO. The glare filled pictures in the ebay auction are keeping myself and others from determining that detail. I asked for more detailed pictures also before starting this thread. I have not gotten a response ether.

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« Reply #110 on: October 17, 2017, 04:05:35 PM »

Here is an excellent example of "incorrect" wheels with "correct" backspacing.  Notice the difference in front profile which can be clearly seen when the wheels are painted.  Also, these wheels have the FORD oval on them while correct Hertz wheels were made by the Motor Wheel Co. and have completely different markings.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Magnum-500-Wheel-14-x-6-SHELBY-Mustang-Hertz-set-of-2-1960s-/162712695449?hash=item25e26eb299:g:F8MAAOSwgkxZ1~mx&vxp=mtr

Craig R

« Last Edit: October 17, 2017, 04:08:13 PM by SHELB66 » Logged

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« Reply #111 on: October 17, 2017, 05:03:07 PM »

Here is an excellent example of "incorrect" wheels with "correct" backspacing.  Notice the difference in front profile which can be clearly seen when the wheels are painted.  Also, these wheels have the FORD oval on them while correct Hertz wheels were made by the Motor Wheel Co. and have completely different markings.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Magnum-500-Wheel-14-x-6-SHELBY-Mustang-Hertz-set-of-2-1960s-/162712695449?hash=item25e26eb299:g:F8MAAOSwgkxZ1~mx&vxp=mtr

Craig R

Hi Craig,  Please find out what markings are on the rim.  They will be different than 795 JK.

Thanks

Cory

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Bob Gaines
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« Reply #112 on: October 17, 2017, 09:09:36 PM »

I got a much clearer picture from seller. It looks like a genuine rim and the backspacing looks right too. I asked for a ruler but the credit card will work. What say my peers.



* Hertz wheel three.jpg (18.05 KB, 800x1422 - viewed 101 times.)
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« Reply #113 on: October 18, 2017, 07:31:34 AM »

Threads like this are what makes this forum and club so valuable.  There was a thread several years ago showing the differences and I agree with Bob - once you see it, it becomes easy.  I want to thank Bill Collins for pointing out this difference live on camera back in the early 90s when he delivered 2059 to us.  I still have the video dubbed from 8mm to VHS that I should digitize while I'm still able.  He also did a similar video when delivering the K code.  So glad I have those videos.  I hope they are still playable.  I do have one remaining VCR in the house (:

 Chug a Lug

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« Reply #114 on: October 18, 2017, 07:47:07 AM »

    Craig that (1972) wheel is also available in chrome. I too fell victim to buying a set of them "knowing" there was "only" one 14x6 Magnum ( yea right) I paid $200 for the set and was totally disappointed when they arrived as they had safety beads , a total NO NO . I was not aware Ford had a 6" Magnum , I thought they were all 7' wide.  Fortunately I found a Maverick owner in desperate need of a set . I learned what they were for and  a valuable lesson. If the seller displays a Ford logo stamp , RUN, they are late model wheels.  I do know what the wheel is supposed to look like in person ( I have 11 of the originals) but the way the pictures were taken on the ones I bought , it was impossible for me to tell. Thanks for posting the pictures.

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owner 6S477 HERTZ White w/Blue stripes-1of18-since 1974. OVER 3,500 drag strip runs made in it since then. My candidate for the "worlds Most drag raced Shelby" More added all the time.
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« Reply #115 on: October 18, 2017, 10:10:20 PM »

Here is an excellent example of "incorrect" wheels with "correct" backspacing.  Notice the difference in front profile which can be clearly seen when the wheels are painted.  Also, these wheels have the FORD oval on them while correct Hertz wheels were made by the Motor Wheel Co. and have completely different markings.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Ford-Magnum-500-Wheel-14-x-6-SHELBY-Mustang-Hertz-set-of-2-1960s-/162712695449?hash=item25e26eb299:g:F8MAAOSwgkxZ1~mx&vxp=mtr

Craig R

The part number or marking on the "hoop" portion on these wheels were reported to me as 941, not 795.  This is how motor wheel ID'd their "hoops".  They also have 14X6 JJ, not JK like the Hertz and Chrysler wheel.  I am not sure the significance of this two character code.  If you find a chrome Magnum 500 with 795C, 14X6 JK on the hoop with a 3.375 back spacing, even without a visual confirmation, it will be a Hertz GT350H wheel.  No doubt.  But it doesn't hurt to confirm visually too.

Take care

Cory

P.S.  I believe the original posted auction wheels are service part GT350H wheels.  However, the price to restore a OEM wheel would be about half the two priced, so the price for the two is not too fare off.

« Last Edit: October 18, 2017, 10:14:33 PM by 6S1640 » Logged
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« Reply #116 on: October 19, 2017, 06:57:46 AM »

Adding more info to this topic for future reference...

http://saacforum.com/index.php?topic=41760.0

Will check to see if the entire topic can be moved here.

I downloaded the photos from the ebay ads mentioned and will add them too.

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« Reply #117 on: October 19, 2017, 09:56:16 AM »

^^^  Great idea!  Thanks for doing that, Rodster.  It makes for a much more comprehensive reference source.

Craig R

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« Reply #118 on: October 19, 2017, 10:05:14 AM »

I'm sure you also remembered these motor wheels were also sold by sears, Montgomery ward, k mart and most wheel and tie stores. I have two hertz mags I got off of a Hudson jet! (on a totaled 350 h) phred

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« Reply #119 on: October 23, 2017, 07:34:29 AM »

^^^  Great idea!  Thanks for doing that, Rodster.  It makes for a much more comprehensive reference source.

Craig R

You're welcome and thanks to Bill for merging the topics.  Chug a Lug  I will add the pictures next.

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